Coming Out

ems wrote:

trevor, i didnt find that funny, the falling into the pond part was like a little funny and thats like it. now, tell the story about your parents!!!

oh man, THAT was funny. hahaha.


all right, since i know u guys r all dying 2 know bout me, here goes. ill just give a list sort of in chronological order



stepsister/sister: k so wen i was like 15 i think, i came across the aim sn of 1 of my now-stepsister's friends (she was just the daughter of my dads gf b4 he got married) cody. i figured i type it in, say hi 2 them. as it turned out, he was gay also which i was surprised about. so i told him in confidence that i was gay also & that he cudnt tell my stepsister. he promised. so a few months later im fighting w/ my sister & at 1 point, she yelled at me "y dont u go cry about it 2 yer boyfriend cody!" needless 2 say i was rly shocked. so i figured that cody lied 2 me, told my stepsister who told my sister who then yelled it bak at me. i didnt deny or confess 2 it at the time.

mom: WHEN xactly my mom found out, idk. but 1 day we were in the car & we started talkin bout stuff & she was all "wen u grow up, yer gf or wife is gonna want...blah blah blah..." i sed at 1 point that that was never gonna happen & she kept asking y not? but then at 1 point she goes "is it cuz.....yer gay?" all i cud do, cuz at this point i was almost in tears from the general convo, was nod my head. later on, i asked how she knew & she told me she had NOT ONLY READ ALL OF MY AIM CONVERSATIONS SINCE I WAS 12, but that she had also READ MY JOURNAL (yes, journal, not diary) but she didnt say WHEN she had done all that. needless 2 say, i was xtremely pissed about that bcuz i knew xactly which entry she was talking about (i had never sed in it that i was gay. insted, i had described a fantasy about me & a boy in the neighborhood). i was so pissed but i didnt wanna get on her case cuz i knew it wud only embarrass me more. i was also rly pissed about her reading ALL my aim conversations on aim since i was 12.

also, she told me later on that 1 day, she was talking 2 my sister wen my mom sed 2 her "did u know that yer brothers gay?" & apparently my sister sed "yeah mom ive known 4 a while now." AGAIN, i was very mad at my mom wen she told me that cuz she cuda outed me 2 my sister if she hadnt alredy known

dad/stepmom: apparently 1 day my mom & dad were talking & my dad was complaining about 1 of my friends & sed sumthin along the lines of "sumtimes i think that kid must be gay or sumthin." 2 which my MOM replied "did u ever think that yer own son might be gay?" once again, i was pissed at my mom cuz she had pretty much just outed me 2 my dad. she told me the convo they had like 2 yrs ago. maybe like a year & a half ago, i was at my dads house & 1 day, i left up the nifty website on the comp while i ate lunch in the kitchen. my stepmom went over 2 the comp 2 use it & i cud then c her looking at the screen, clearly reading wat was on it. i was rly embarrassed by it, but i didnt say nething 2 her bout it cuz after a few secs, she closed it, logged me out & went into hers 2 do work or sumthin. apparently later on, she emailed my dad at work & told him. then, maybe a year & a half ago my dad was talking 2 me unrelated, but the topic got brought up & i sed yes, im gay & i sed 2 him "but u alredy knew that, didnt u." he sed yeah & then we kept talking bout the intended convo


the most fucked up part about it is that NONE of my family was supose 2 know about me being gay until I told them, which i had bin planning on either during or after college.

my mom always sez "can i ask u a personal question?" & i hate it wen she dus cuz it makes me feel awkward & i hate it. im very mad at her 4 everything she did, but at the least, shes very accepting

That's kinda screwed up dude, sorry that all that happened to you
At least everyone's OK with it right? I mean, no matter how annoying it is to be outed it kinda takes a weight off of your shoulders.

wen it comes 2 my family, no. im still unhappy w/ them knowing cuz i wanted 2 come out on MY terms.

dare de-vil wrote:

wen it comes 2 my family, no. im still unhappy w/ them knowing cuz i wanted 2 come out on MY terms.

I guess I can understand that. But can you ever see a time when you might forgive them, or when it won't be such an issue?

Well props for the story Kell.
It does seem your Mom is quite obnoxious. Well take it easy on them, as they are probably not taking it easy on themselves.

every1 is fine w/ it. its ME who dusnt like them knowing, especially my mother. i honestly know if i can ever 4give her 4 snooping like that

her excuse was "i wanted t'make sure u werent doing drugs or nething like that"

yeah, like if i were doing drugs, id write it down.

"april 12

today i smoked a joint"


"september 23

this morning i tried meth. it was so awesome i wrote it down."


i mean seriously, wtf?

Thanks for the story K.

I'm kind of at a loss to know what to say. Being outed sucks but at least you didn't have parents who beat the shit out of you and threw you to the curb. Not that that is much of a cancelation prize.

As for mom's 'spying' on their kids, I think that is fairly common. They think of it as their responsibility. The problem is where to draw the lines -- boundaries. We all need boundaries and it is especially difficult to draw them with parents who have no idea of the concept. A large part of growing up has to do with defining those boundaries for one's self. It helps if you have parents who at least understand the concept, why boundaries are necessary, how they need to be respected and how they can help build closer relationships.

Dysfunctional family systems are mostly about either an absence of boundaries or boundaries that are all drawn in screwy ways. The problem with growing up in family systems like that is that whether one accepts them or rebels against them, they've gotten formed at a deep level in our own psyches. THEN, when we go out into the world and begin building relationships of our own, these patterns re-emerge and are often re-established in new relationships which end up feeling as unsatisfying as the old ones.

It takes a lot of inner work to discover what is going on and begin the life-long process of redefining the boundaries.

I say all this like I know what I'm talking about, which I do to some extent, but the fact is even with all my learning experiences there is so much I don't know and may never understand about myself -- why I am the way I am. And I don't just mean being gay. That's only one part of me. It is an important part but it isn't even the most important part of my life. I don't think I even began to fully grasp THAT until I was, like, 30 or something.

One thing I'm getting from what all you guys have said so far is how different the times are now regarding being gay. For me growing up it was very schizoid because on one hand I was having sexual experiences but on the other hand it was like that never happened. NO ONE talked about it at all. There was no "discussion" of "gays" in the media or in society in general. It was like they/we didn't exist! The word wasn't in the common speech -- I didn't even hear it in the context of homosexuality until about 1965 or so. After the Stonewall riots all that began to change in terms of social awareness but only barely. I know there is still a lot of misunderstanding about what being "gay" is or means and still a lot of homophobia but at least there is some idea that being gay isn't like being -- I don't know what -- some total social degenerate or something.

In any case, I can't imagine "coming out" to any of my family when I was a teenager or in my early 20s. If I had been "outed" by someone it would have been beyond embarrassing, beyond mortifying, it would have been a scandal. There certainly wouldn't have been any acceptance at all. I suspect my parents, and my dad in particular, would have first had me committed to a mental institution and then disowned me to boot. Everyone would have been all freaked out about it and especially the prospect that it might get "known" by other people in the community. IOW, no one would have cared what I felt, it would all have been about saving some mythical family image in society or something.

NEway. I know it isn't easy so don't get me wrong. Every time I hear about a gay teenager who has killed himself I feel like throwing up because I know how close I came to being one myself. Then I get REALLY pissed off that things, even now, are so fucked up that kids would rather take themselves out than have to face the pain, fear, confusion and all the rest of it.

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gosh! all these coming out stories are like so not what you expect! i was expecting all sorts of drama in trevor's, was disappointed. i reluctantly read kell's 'LONG' post, and idk... there's that 'thing' that is missing!

but, thank you for telling us.

What were you expecting E?
Maybe I could make one up (with pictures!) and youd be happy then.

maybe...

i was reading this thread again and i was like "wow, im extremely mean and insensitive!!" so i would like to apologize to every that i had offended. but like alex said, it must feel like a weight off of your shoulder. something that i do not have... yet.

haha

nicks18 wrote:

painter wrote:

I don't remember what we'd been talking about but we were both in our PE shorts and tanks and he walked up to me and put his arms around me and started rubbing his crotch against mine, pushing me backwards until I was up against the coach's desk.

Can I say something...THAT WAS EFFIN HOT! Gee, you were probably the yummiest eye candy during your time Mr. Mike...got a picture?

Hey Nick -- Yeah, that image is right out of some porno movie, isn't it? Still, it actually happened. Too bad I froze up -- but, then again, maybe not. Who knows.

NEway as for pix, I don't have many. Remember, I've really cut myself off from my family and did long, long ago. I also didn't like having my picture taken so there never were very many of me. Still, I do have a few and to post them I had to first find the time to find them and then scan them.

The first one below is obviously a school pic but it doesn't have a date on it. I'd guess I'm about 12 (1960). And, yes, my eyes were that intense -- and still are although not so innocent. LoL! I love this pic of me -- hard to imagine I was ever that cute. And, yes, I was a little devil.



This next one is also a school pic, 1964. So, I would have been 16 -- probably just barely -- and this would have been around the time the above 'porn scene' happened. I feel the need to apologize for the hair. Probably when you guys are my age you'll be embarrassed by the way your hair looks now, too. But at least I HAD hair -- which is no longer the case. Sigh. I miss having hair, I really do. I love looking at it and often imagine what I'd do with it if I had any now. We're much more creative with guys' hair now than we used to be.




This third one is cropped out of a snap shot taken from some distance with a lousy lense so it isn't very good but it is one of the few that shows me standing. Note the 'ballerina' positioning of the feet, the placement of the hands and the downward tilted head. Besides the fact the sun was in my eyes (people who take snap shots are so stupid sometimes) ALL this was quite intentional on my part. I was FAR from innocent, trust me, but I was very good at seeming invisibly unassuming. LOL! I also note my pants are too short so this would have been later in '64, or early '65 when I would have just turned 17. My B-day is in January and since I'm wearing long pants, it was probably winter. This was taken in Florida, where I went to high school, thus the big naval oranges on the tree. One of the things cropped out of the picture is my dad holding them up on display for the camera. Why he was holding them close to me is a mystery. My hair is a bit longer too, probably just beginning to get into letting it grow. By 1967 it was near shoulder length, which was common in those days. I wish I had a picture from my hippy era but I don't. (Try to imagine me in desert boots with wide-wale corduroys, wide belt, Naru collard shirt and a CAPE. Yep. That was me!)



Hope that satisfies your curiosity!

you look like cartoon character in the second picture, lol.

drool...stare...drool...

Even though its not in the Very Hot People section, I firmly believe it belongs there. I know I know Kell_ _ _ _ _ said were not supposed to for many reasons. But isn't he just adorable?


12? I am sooo a pedophile...grrrr...

Besides this guy isn't even the present. Its a picture of someone before. So Im gonna ask permission from Mr. Mike if I can fantasize over Little Mike.

Curiosity satisfied?
Oh yeah...

Thanks Mr. Mike.

i didnt say anything about that coz i felt i was crossing the line, lol. but yeah... i TOTALLY get you nick!

nicks18 wrote:

So Im gonna ask permission from Mr. Mike if I can fantasize over Little Mike.

That's a complement, Nick, thanks. Little Mike would certainly have gotten off on the idea. Weren't those eyes made for undressing boys in his mind and those lips made for rapping themselves around a . . . The very idea that someone else would be fantasizing about him never crossed his mind. He thought he was 'funny looking'; had no idea how cute he really was.

Now, we've gotten off topic here -- so do you guys have anything more to say about coming out or not coming out?

The only reason I started this topic is because I know this isn't easy for a lot of guys. There can be all kinds of questions, fears, worries, stuff that gets all wadded up in our heads and our hearts and I think sometimes it can be a help to talk about all this stuff. I know you guys like to kid around and tease one another but I'm also wondering if you can see the value of "being there" for one another, listening to one another, caring about one another, helping one another. Damn, I wish I'd had the internet when I was a teenager -- and not just to look at 'hot people' which I certainly would have. But to find other guys who were in the same boat as me, wondering about all this shit and trying to make sense of it in my own head? That would have been even more important to me. But, I don't know, times change -- maybe you guys don't feel as isolated and confused about it all as I did growing up. To me, what it is really all about is how one feels about one's self. So, that's the question. Do you guys feel ok about yourselves? Are you ok with how you are?

.

my parents want me to get plastic surgery LOL!!!!! but im like perfectly happy with myself!

yup

painter wrote:

Do you guys feel ok about yourselves? Are you ok with how you are?

.

Absolutely

painter wrote:

nicks18 wrote:

So Im gonna ask permission from Mr. Mike if I can fantasize over Little Mike.

That's a complement, Nick, thanks. Little Mike would certainly have gotten off on the idea. Weren't those eyes made for undressing boys in his mind and those lips made for rapping themselves around a . . . The very idea that someone else would be fantasizing about him never crossed his mind. He thought he was 'funny looking'; had no idea how cute he really was.

Now, we've gotten off topic here -- so do you guys have anything more to say about coming out or not coming out?

The only reason I started this topic is because I know this isn't easy for a lot of guys. There can be all kinds of questions, fears, worries, stuff that gets all wadded up in our heads and our hearts and I think sometimes it can be a help to talk about all this stuff. I know you guys like to kid around and tease one another but I'm also wondering if you can see the value of "being there" for one another, listening to one another, caring about one another, helping one another. Damn, I wish I'd had the internet when I was a teenager -- and not just to look at 'hot people' which I certainly would have. But to find other guys who were in the same boat as me, wondering about all this shit and trying to make sense of it in my own head? That would have been even more important to me. But, I don't know, times change -- maybe you guys don't feel as isolated and confused about it all as I did growing up. To me, what it is really all about is how one feels about one's self. So, that's the question. Do you guys feel ok about yourselves? Are you ok with how you are?

.

Deep down, I think we do realize the value of being there for each other. The teasing and the occassional mean comments are (hopefully) done in good taste and to show that we're really okay and comfortable with each other, and that we do have each other's backs.

coming out to myself:
I had just started 7th grade when I found myself wanting to be more than just friends with the kid across the street from me. The idea that I might actually be gay kinda freaked me out, and being young and uneducated on the matter, I thought there was something wrong with me that was making me gay. So in an attempt to "un-gay" myself (like I said... young and stupid lol) I started seriously looking for a girlfriend.
One day about a month into 7th grade, the girl who sat behind me tapped me on the shoulder and was like "hey chris, jade likes you", so I was like alright. I didn't talk to her about it that day because if i remember right she wasn't there, and also I wasn't sure if she really liked me or her friend just wanted me to do something that would result in me making an ass out of myself. Over the next couple weeks I started talking to her and figured she actually did like me, so I decided to sack up and ask her to go to our middle school dance with me. So we started hanging out like all the time after that, but by the end of the school year I didn't really feel any differently than I did back in September. I kinda wish I told her then that we shouldn't go out anymore, but I didn't and we ended up staying together until last October.

coming out to jade:
Something that was long overdue... telling my girlfriend of 6 years that i'm gay. I was just hoping she wouldn't get really pissed off and be like "wtf i can't believe i wasted 6 years of my life with you, you fucking faggot" or something like that. She isn't homophobic or anything at all, but if she reacted that way I think I could understand it. So I called her one night and told her I had to talk to her about something important, then drove down to her house feeling nervous as hell the whole way there.

her: what's up?
me: so, um........ I like guys.
her: is that it?
(that really surprised me... definitely didn't expect that)
me: yeah...
her: I'm not as surprised as you might expect me to be
me: clearly
her: yeah, for like a year now I thought you might be, but i didn't want to talk to you about it because it would be awkward for both of us if you actually weren't.

So yeah, she was cool with it, which was great. It was kinda weird though to think that my girlfriend... the one person I really wanted to think I was straight, knew, so it got me wondering how many other people know.

coming out to my brother:
I didn't really "come out" to my brother... he kinda just found out. Back in May, me and my ex, mark, were done with school for the summer and hanging out at my house. I guess we both lost track of time, because my brother who's still in high school, came home to find me and mark in a make-out session on our couch. omg the look on his face was priceless. Then he actually asked me "dude, are you gay?" The poor kid was so stunned I couldn't make fun of him for asking such a ridiculous question, I was just like "no... don't you do this with your friends?" Then I asked him not to tell our mom, and he said he wouldn't but that he was pretty sure she already knew. He thought that because apparently one day he told our mom he thought I might be gay, and she was like yeah, I think you're right.

I haven't actually told my mom yet, and don't plan on doing it until I finish college even though she probably already knows (and so does everyone else I've ever come in contact with apparently) so even though i haven't been breaking news to anyone, at least nobody has stopped talking to me or anything after I told them.

give more detail on wen yer bro walked in